debbie sanchez is a disgusting leech. she preyed on our most innocent comodity and stole part of our kids life and learning by being a lecherous thief. her selfish ways should not go unpunished! why didn't her picture get plastered on the web site for everyone to see? she needed to be publicly humiliated for her heinous crime!

There you go Gary, why don't you give the PTA President and Treaurer the same consideration as you do the accused. You make slanderous allegations about their fiduciary responsibility when they are not accused. Innocent until proven guilty. You and I do not have the facts but you choose to make summary judgements against the ones who found the discrepancy. You are wrong here.

@ barry_geltzeiler: I am not making "slanderous allegations" against anyone; I'm simply attempting to reassure the readers that (to my knowledge) safeguards are generally in place to prevent such things from happening...at least they were back in my day!

Parents should have som e faith that the PTAs they are contributing their time, effort and money to are being run responsibly.

That said (though I wouldn't know the woman if I fell over her) the article indicates Ms. Sanchez was the "former Mt. Pleasant PTA president." If that's true, it can only be assumed that this embezzlement happened on her watch. Are you saying an independent audit (as was required in my day) was done and nothing was found amiss?

Embezzlement generally occurs when there are no checks and balance or when someone intentionally tries to cook the books and hide their tracks. That's just common sense, Barry. If there's something I'm missing here that's common public knowledge, please educate us.

@Gary Englert from my knowledge the audit was done on a yealy basis, which leaves 364 days in between to embezzle. Plus when the person running the program also handles the money there is more room for issues. Please wait for the information come out through the proper channels. This is a tough time time for all involved and nobody is happy here from the accused and her family right down to the PTA Pres and Treas whose investiggation polarized the Mt Pleasant Community. Your comments only ignite the situation and does nothing to help a volitale situation.

@ barry_geltzeiler: I'm sorry friend but, I rather doubt my comments are about to "ignite the situation" that has already been burning pretty hot for some time.

Other than recounting my personal experience with PTAs (and simply trying to offer some assurances to the public by doing so) and a common sense observation, I certainly haven't taken sides.

Final questions (if you know the answers):

1. Back in my day, two signatures were required on every check written on a PTA account; is that still a requirement?

2. Are you suggesting that the alleged embezzlement (that's the subject of the indictment) occurred between two annual audits and was confined to a single fiscal year?

3. Was Ms. Sanchez the PTA President during the period in question?

Gary i know what I am told and will not reveal out of respect to all partys involved as you should do the same. Peoples families are involved here, these are not politicians who chose to be in the public eye. YES you are igniting the situation, with your judgements and comments. Let this play out as the more comments made only hurt ALL of the families involved.

@ barry_geltzeiler: While I certainly appreciate your personal empathy for the people and families involved, I must take exception to your assertion that I've made any judgment about anything or anyone, as I most certainly have not.

What I've done is to make some general comments (based on my personal experience and common sense) and asked a couple of questions to confirm that what I knew to be common practice (when I was involved in PTAs) was still in effect, and that's about it.

I clearly do not know if the charges brought were justified nor whether the accused is guilty.

Talking about the structure of a PTA, the offficer's responsibilities (as I understand them) and the controls that should be in place is not casting aspersions on anyone.

All that said, any attempt to dissuade people from talking about this (and there are those with a far greater stake in it all than I) is a futile effort; that horse has already long since left the barn and I'm pretty late to the party, Barry.

Those of us who are involved in and concerned with the community, and the school system, should have as much discussion of this as necessary to insure such a situation (whatever it turns out to actually be) doesn't happen again...and I reserve the right to do so.

Here's your judgemntal quote Gary "My guess is that, at a minimum, someone failed in their fiduciary responsibiity and no such audits were done, If they had been, I rather doubt there would have been need for any investigation and subsequent indictment." You have no empahty for anyone. You have taken on a self imposed "board moderator" judge and jury stance. All you have are assumptions from the little facts you do know. There are CHILDREN old enough to read this stuff involved. Let it be, find a different story to preside over. There is enough tension over the past year and you don't realize what you are dredging up. Let go already, your input is not needed nor wanted.

@ barry_geltzeiler: The operative phrases in my quote are "My guess" and "I rather doubt" as neither conveys a definitive judgment and more than imply my willingness to be convinced otherwise.

Absolutely nothing that I've said can or should be misconstrued as my playing judge or jury as I certainly have not proclaimed anyone's guilt or innocence of anything and for you to say so is just disengenuous!

An individual has been accused of a crime, they've appeared in court for arraignment and have plead not guilty; all of which has been publicized in the media.

None of that is my doing and nothing I've said will equal or greater impact on anyone, their children or family, than what has already occurred.

You really seem overly sensitive about this entire matter as nothing I've said should be putting a burr under your saddle.

My position on this is abundantly clear: 1. I don't know what happened here or if the charges are justified, 2. there should be adequate controls already in place to prevent misappropriation of PTA funds, and 3. the accused is innocent until proven guilty.

If you're looking for a more reasonable stance from any casual observer, you're not likely to find it.

I am not overly sensitive but know all the players personally since I lived in the nieghborhood. I know the pain they are all dealing with and the friendships that were destroyed.
then you open your fabulous mouth with a position of accusing the PTA president and treasurer of not doing their job, and now you change your story to a reasonable stance. Go back to the Nj.com boards and protect the politicians and leave this quiet neighborhood to heal their wounds. You are nothing more than a wash woman here trying to air out the dirty laundry. It will take years for this to come to a conclusion and more for the neighborhood to come back together. Once again t\the impact has been done but you seem to enjoy fanning the flames. Let this be.

@ barry_geltzeiler: I would suggest you re-read what I wrote (not what your think I wrote) which was:

"My guess is that, at a minimum, someone failed in their fiduciary responsibiity and no such audits were done, If they had been, I rather doubt there would have been need for any investigation and subsequent indictment."

Again, that's not accusing anyone of anything: it's a common sense observation, based on practical experience as to why the current situaiton might exist and is certainly NOT definitive; the operative phrase being "My guess.."

I've never had any reason to treat you with anything other than dignity and respect and would suggest you reciprocate. I'll make no apologies for my "fabulous mouth" as it has served me and this community rather well.

I'm neither "fanning flames" nor "airing dirty laundry" (as there's none concerning this matter that I have in my basket); rather, I'm making some wholly reasonable comments on a message board.

Having actually fought for our collective freedom of speech, and been covered in the blood of some who have died for it, I'll responsibly exercise it where and when I see fit.

no ever questions the sacrifice you made for our country, i asked you to leave this alone. All of the people involved do not need your input and judgements. They are all good people and let the system do its job. The accused, past PTA officers and current PTA officers all have children in the same schools and same classes, and they are the ones most affected by this and your input only makes it worse. So for the sake of the children get off your soapbox and let this issue be. Enough damage has been done and nobody needs your comments and opinions. You hijack every thread you involve yourself in and make your opinion sound like fact. ONCE AGAIN FOR ALL OF THE CHILDREN INVOLVED LEAVE THIS ALONE!!!!!!!!

I must say Barry is going on and on about the neighborhood and the friendships..and how it's been going on for the past year...You knew it had to get worse when the story went public..you can't be that naive.....and let us not forget that this is not a rumor, Ms. Sanchez was actually CHARGED with this crime. You know that people are going to have opinions and you can't stop them.

@Concerned use your real name and I'll respond to you, you don't have enough conviction to even put your name behind your comments.

@ barry_geltzeiler: To the contrary, I state facts and my opinions may sound like they are just that because they are based on fact and not unbridled nonsense.

Your assertions (that I am "playing judge and jury, igniting fires or fanning flames" here) are just so much unbridled nonsense as is the suggestion I "hijack every thread I involve (myself) in."

I forcefully and passionately defend myself, my opinions and that which I believe in...period.

Should you wish to continue this discussion off-line, please feel free to contact me at grenglert@aol.com

@ Barry, there is a reason I do not use my name.....Are you that uncomfortable having a conversation with someone that you don't know their name? And you don't even need to address my post, I just wanted to express my opinion that things get worse once something is brought to the attention of the public.

Gary it sounds like from your comment that if the PTA President and Treasurer at the time did what they were responsible to do then it would not have gotten to this but if the PTA President was allegedly stealing it sounds like by not doing "their fiduciary responsibility" it was to her advantage to continue to allegedly steal.

Well to me it's obvious that they must have some pretty solid evidence against Ms. Sanchez being she was the only one that was charged. Otherwise, I am sure others would be involved in the charge.

"gave much of her her personal time" but if Ms. Sanchez is found to be guilty for the allegations then she paid herself more money than most folks make in a year

True! Time will tell as the case progresses.

i couldn't agree you more Sherely. BTW it was great to see ytou yesterday, I loved watching "K" play basket ball!!!!

the accusers.

Do you know Ms. Sanchez?

Not sure how your post can be a generalization when the "money was allegedly taken" by Ms. Sanchez. Who else can you be referring to when you write "it's just sad that people just can do the right thing..."?? I am indeed reviewing the thoughts of others contrast to your post which seems to not take the thoughts or feelings of all involved. Whether I know Ms. Sanchez personally is irrelevant. What's important is to not make such remarks as you do until all of the facts are known.

I would just like to say that I am sick to my stomach that $101,000 is actually missing from an elementary school PTA. I don't care who took it. Just the fact that this money is for programs for the kids, especially with all the budget cuts. This person should be ashamed of themselves. When the truth comes out, and it will, I hope the punishment is severe. I hope all you people out there don't take my post as being accusatory, I am not. She is innocent until proven guilty, and along the line maybe others will be charged. I don't know.

"I support the PTA and the PTA at Saint Cloud were my children are does so very positive things."
So your kids are back at St. Cloud? Following your posts I thought they went to a private religious school.

@ Adam Kraemer: Suffice it to say that (without getting into details and compromising anyone's position here) I know enough about this situation to feel that it was an anomoly and that adequate financial controls are already in place. While surprised that someone considering another run for the Board of Ed isn't wired into such things, contact me off-line if you require further explanation.

I'm calling Shenanigans on you. That sounds highly unlikely. She was charged with theft, not check fraud. Your post should be dismissed. I don't think any reasonable, intelligent person would believe you. Patch should really delete your post.

@ Concerned in WO: I'm not judging anyone, simply expressing an opinion with considerable merit: that anonymously posting alleged details of methodology used to commit an alleged crime on an Internet message board serves no useful purpose.

Only when and if Proud Mt. Pleasant identifies herself, testifies in a court of law and the check alluded to is presented into evidence will this tale have any practical effect or move the ball down field.

Until then, it reamins an anonymous and unsubstantiated story wafting around in cyberspace.

@Concerned, it isn't actually an opinion she is making. She is making a criminal accusation of check fraud and I haven't seen that in the list of charges, and NO ONE has the right to do that! If my bank cashed a check where my Pay to had been altered, I would certainly be at my bank with a bee in my bonnet and I think ALOT of parents would have noticed that. You have to admit, the whole scenario sounds highly unlikely. You don't think things are made up on the internet, especially if you can do so anonymously? I do no believe you are that naive.
I do not condone the actions of Ms. Sanchez, I just despise people who use the internet to slander others.

Everyone needs to disabuse themselves of the notion that anything posted anonymously (about this matter or anything else), particularly an accusation concerning criminality, holds absolutely no weight.

First and foremost, there is a presumptive right to face one's accuser and that's surely an impossibility if they aren't identified.

Those willing to have been deposed, who presented proofs and a willingness to testify at trial are who and what will be given as much credibility as is warranted,

Anonymous post on a website?

Not so much.

@Concerned in WO, if what they say happened with the check is a lie, then the comment is libel.